Dumper bucket holes

[TrevorJ]

Jeremy's idea of hiring in a welder is a good idea, when someone says "mig" one doesn't know if they mean 200 amps max at say a reasonable 60 percent or better duty cycle or 130 amps max at 20 to 40 percent duty cycle ... including bonus jumper battery leads that are almost 100A on a good day they've attached for ground and work instead of something decent. (I've had to use one or two in my time, back then I had plenty of 400 amp leads I would temporarily clamp onto the work if I could and ground, and a roll of tape to keep it neat while the small job was done, twas a pity I wasn't charging, just helping out mostly.)

Wind suggests arc welding is a better low fuss option, with a GP rod for low carbon steels or a more suitable rod for better type steels.

essexpete, I'd agree, mild steel would probably do, a lot of half ton and one ton fertilizer boxes (on a tractor implement toolbar) were patched or rebuilt using what was available in 3mm or 4mm section ... too bad folk, mild steel only by way of Bluescope here. By higher tensile, I don't mean by much, even "Merchant Stock" eg used in wheel rims might be well suited and easily had over in your parts ...

Mig welding is prone to being outdoors, and more gas is not the solution, setting up good shields is, but not at point where the shielding gas accumulates, even with no top tarp, especially if for price one has moved back to carbon dioxide gas. Hypoxia is not fun but generally usual situations this will never happen ... just be very wary of welding in half enclosed areas room enough to get head and shoulders into and forget how long one can hold their breath.

I'd suggest welding a bit of same type scrap first to get a feel of what settings work decently.

Outdoors, extension leads are usually the biggest issue ... and it's best IMHO, to have something rated at least 1.5 / 2 times more than what the mig will use. As I generally welded outdoors, (not so much in the last 10 years) I had some 4mm[sup]2[/sup] lead with ends ... it was possibly illegal, rules change ... but always planed to ensure I didn't know too much, I no longer recall what electrician made them and it was probably only going to be me that got injured.

So from a legal point, you may plan getting an electrician to put in underground cable and external power point if you don't already have one near where you plan to work.

[MrF]

Not to rudely want to divert you elsewhere, but there's a site dedicated to welding for amateurs that's uk based and not just for mig process, but covers tig, arc etc. You might find more comprehensive info about welding and machines available etc there. https://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/
I dont post there, but I know its amateur friendly & some of the people doing bucket repairs and repairing heavy equipment do, and you'll soon work out who knows their stuff from people posting just for the sake of it. The welding forums dedicated to professionals tend to be a bit unfriendly to amateurs.

Personally I think for bucket repairs etc on thicker sections stick is king although it takes a bit more technique initially, with mig its easy to make a nice looking weld that's not very structurally strong. And I like modern small inverter sets, because after years of dragging half a ton of transformer source round by its lifting eyes I have seen the light & I find myself almost always using the inverter sets now even for stick, and the mig and tig sources are so much nicer to use with a more stable arc that's more controllable with parameters I wonder why I took so long to switch. They also have much much less requirements on your mains power source, so thinner leads, more normal sockets etc are the order of the day.

[Jeremy Rowland]

Phil it's always good to get advice when your a novice at something; for me welding is not one of the things I do for a long enough time period to get good at it. I will post pictures of my next efforts when I do a bit more work on the 580BT.

Jeremy

[TrevorJ]

The problem with anything, the inexperienced can't tell what's hype and what's not. Then again I hear a fair bit of hype even from those who've been welding (though not professionally) for years. I started off with the occasional rubbish weld, but when I started I had no one I could ask for what I should be watching out for or the fact variable single phase networks suck. (The region was almost all stick or the occasional submerged arc in an industrial workshop.) In the end I learned short circut migging was very easy to stuff up and one should NEVER rely on it for a strong secure well bonded structural weld if one is making large fillet runs. It's too easy to miss that some of the the parent material not wetting in certain places.

By the end while I had half decent eyesight and hearing, I reached a point I could confidently weld snapped slasher blades, (by that I mean use them afterwards out in the rocks where they originally broke from not being tempered correctly) typically made from very high tensile steel or alloy. (P.S. There's no "try" with such things, if the end comes off fast moving objects due to a bad weld ... even in the case of a slasher blade end, fixing or replacing a tractor tyre is not the worse thing that could happen.) These days work health and safety would probably want them xrayed and tested first.

Yup love these new inverter types, worked with arc types but not migs ... yet. I have used one for a couple of minutes but not long enough to get a good feel.

One day I plan to get an inverter mig tig arc welder.

P.S. Tip: Don't opt for gasless wire as a way around not shielding. (If not for remembering the required swap of polarity ... and while most welders can, some cheap migs I've seen about don't have a means to swap polarity until it's modified.) Most of the small rolls one can buy over this way aren't worth a pinch, even in really good welder setups and I though I'm pretty much a novice, I've seen pros struggle, when asked what they think might be wrong, to get a weld out that doesn't look like chicken scratching. Flux cored with gas is an option, typically seen and used in bigger wire diameters larger than 1.2mm ... though for the smaller workshops, 1.2 versions exist. Like gasless wires, one has to be careful not to set the wire feed spring too hard, else risk deforming the wire.

[mechman]

Something like this? There's a few more on my Winget 4s thread, that's not me in the pics. Think the pics are wrong way round.
Norm.

[mechman]

A few more. I'm not bothered about grade of steel as the machine is no longer in daily construction.
Norm.

[This'lldo]

As a retired fabricator/welder I fully appreciate how not welding often enough soon lessens ones ability. Repairing the bucket on a George Fellows dumper made me well aware of this, but I'm now back in the groove.
I cut out the bottom of the bucket right across from side to side and 200mm wide. got a bit of 3mm plate pursuaded to a gentle curve. Use this patching plate to lay in position, scribe along its edges and cut crefull with a thin cutting disc. Using a small angle grinder with a 115mm disc makes accuracy reasonably easy. This gives an edge to edge join, which may seem intimidating but avoids an overlaying patch which can be a rust trap and makes a neater job. Get the cut edge of the bucket hammered as straight as you can, but don't be too fussy. Put the patch in place and tack weld where it touches.
In between the tacks its easy to hammer the original bucketcut edge to match the patch and patch's greater thickness keeps the join straight as you knock the thinner metal into place.
Like others, I'd use stick welding and a good inverter plant is well worth the money, not least because on other jobs it can weld as thin as 16g if the gaps are good.
If you are learning to weld. Start with some 5mm or 6mm scrap to practice on. crank up the amps and blaze away without any worry of blowing holes in the metal. This enables you to control the end of the rod and manage the flow of slag. You can then practice on bits of thinner metal, learning the amp settings needed as you go.
Modern welding helmets with auto darkening screens are also a fantastic improvement on the old style of "Where was the tip of the welding rod, just befor I flipped my visor down"
I hope you soon gain the confidence to tackle the repair, with success.

[Matchless?58]

Wow what a great forum this is ! All the information hints and tips I have received just for the sake of asking are fantastic . It seems like the advice is to use stick for this job . I have a small stick set which I started on but got the mig because I thought it may be more versatile . I also got myself an auto darkening helmet as I was fed up with striking off everywhere but where I wanted to be . I now know that there are no shortcuts but practice . I will certainly be checking out the forum for novice welders ( thanks Mr F ) never knew it existed . Thanks to all who have contributed to this post and given their advice and experience I think it will also help others who want to have a go at welding . My first job was welding up some cracks in the bonnet of the JCB which I used stick for because that was all I had then . That worked out well but I am going to practice a bit more before I tackle the dumper bucket in case I mess it up . I can't exactly go and buy another one ! Thanks once again cheers Chris

[cobbadog]

Chris it sounds as if you have chosen to use the stick welder and I would have as well. But it always comes down to what equipment we have available and you like me have both stick and MIG. In Australia our general purpose rods are numbered 6013 which are a great all round rod. As a suggestion before you attack your bucket grab all the scrap steel you can get your hands on and start sticking them together. Even chopping up what you have just cut out.
Lay down some tack welds where they are butted together and do a run of them about an inch apart taking a short rest in between each tack as the metal will expand and then shrink back into place. Then go back and do short runs joining the tacks but not one against the other, move along the join to allow the section you just did a short 1" run on to cool and again minimise distortion. Practice runs along the flat of the sheet just to get the feel of it all. Always keep in mind when doing a run the angle of the rod and the technique or pattern you choose to move the rod. This can be from circular to like writing the letter 'e' along your runs.
Watch as many videos as possible to try and gain as much information as you possibly can. I watch a lot of YouTube videos as well when I decide to attempt something new in the welding department. I too am only a novice and I had to replace a section of checker plate on the tray of our 8 ton truck. After making sure the new section fitted perfectly and with a small gap along where the welds will go I tacked it in place then had to go under the tray and do some overhead welds to attach the plate to the cross rails then back on top to do my short runs. Finished job was that I am very pleased with the outcome. The other thing I did was to weld a lump of steel to the new section so I had a perfect place to attach the earth lead.
For your project I would use some 3-4mm steel and cut out the section so that the welds are in the corners and not just in from them so it will look good as a finished job. Practice, practice and then practice and really clean up all the surfaces you are going to weld.

The other way of welding using the MIG outside on a windy day is to go flux cored wire or gasless but I have not had a lot of success with that but if inside a shed then gas MIG will be quicker.

Look forward to seeing any and all progress. Good luck with it.

[Matchless?58]

Thanks for the hints and tips cobba . I haven't started this yet as the dumper is still in constant use ATM which is not making the holes in the bucket any better but I figured what the hell I'm going to repair it anyway . I have also been working flat out on the resto of my matchless G2 motorbike as we have a club display in July and I want to show it there . I will post some pics when it's done . A bit off topic but somebody might be interested to see it . Cheers Chris