JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

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JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

Post #1 by br2an » Mon May 14, 2018 10:56 pm

Hi,

Machine - 2001 JCB 214 (US model).

I was using my backhoe today for the first time this year when I lost forward and reverse. It seems like the solenoids won't energize, very similar to when I put it in gear with the park brake engaged. Raised it up and checked, all wheels spin easily.
Crawled to side of road using hoe and shut it off but then the starter would not engage. Tried F-N-D and still no start.

Was just idling along, no strange noise/leaks or anything out of the ordinary (other than no go).

I'm hoping a fuse but did not check them yet. Also thinking it could be something in the shift mechanism? Has anyone here had this happen to them? Any suggestions on where to look?

Thanks,
Brian


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Re: JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

Post #2 by Jeremy Rowland » Tue May 15, 2018 7:15 am

Brian, you say also that the starter would not engage? Daft question but have you got a good battery connection? I'm sure that somebody else on here will be able to offer you some advice. :thumbup:

Jeremy


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Re: JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

Post #3 by essexpete » Tue May 15, 2018 9:27 am

Where is Agrimax when you need him :D

If as Jeremy suggests you have a battery connection will the machine start by shorting out the starter? Make sure the hand brake is on and the manual gear lever in neutral. When you switch on the key to the first stage have you got the usual warning lights?
It does sound like a connection to me and I assume if you lose power to or from the ignition switch you might get the symptoms you describe.


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Re: JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

Post #4 by br2an » Tue May 15, 2018 3:02 pm

Lights come on the dash ok, warning buzzer sounds etc. It doesn't seem to be a bad battery connection as the lights usually flicker and solenoid will attempt to engage if battery connection is bad.

It may just be coincidental that the 2 problems occurred at the same time. I know forward/reverse will not engage if the hand brake is on or if the joystick button is pressed. Also, starter will not engage if in gear. I can't see what they have in common for my problem, was hoping somebody else may have come across this before.

I guess it is time to start trouble shooting. I will go at the starting circuit first, shorting the starter solenoid first as suggested. Then work back to the ignition etc.

I will post again when I have more info.

Thanks,
Brian

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Re: JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

Post #5 by jcb4cx » Tue May 15, 2018 8:23 pm

check the stalk for the forwards/backwards , where the plug joins the wires are twisted around each other and rub through , thinking its in gear and not letting it start
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Re: JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

Post #6 by br2an » Wed May 16, 2018 1:05 am

Well, had a look at the wiring schematics today and saw that forward/reverse and start circuit are all fed from one 10A fuse (# 5a). Checked and it was blown. Replaced and started fine but quickly blew again. And again.

Replaced fuse with an auto reset circuit breaker and tried to see if there was any pattern. Trips breaker in both forward and reverse, never starting. I think it might be a wire ((#107) chafed and grounding out. The stalk mentioned by JCB4cx (thanks) sounds like a good spot. But this fuse also feeds quite a few solenoids and relays so not sure what is the most common culprit.

It won't be an expensive repair but a real pain, especially as it is a mile in the woods on a road I am building.

Will update when I have something.

Thanks,
Brian


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Re: JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

Post #7 by essexpete » Wed May 16, 2018 11:36 am

What a PITA but 4CX's advice was good.

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Re: JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

Post #8 by jcb4cx » Fri May 18, 2018 7:12 pm

It has happened recently to an owner operator , threw up lots of different problems , at one point it only had second gear , then no gears but ran , the would not start , blew the 10a many times
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Re: JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

Post #9 by jcb4cx » Fri May 18, 2018 7:14 pm

If you have not i would check it first , if it looks good , disconnect it and see
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Re: JCB 214 (3CX) No Forward/Reverse/Start

Post #10 by br2an » Fri May 18, 2018 9:18 pm

Well, this puzzle is starting to frustrate me. It seems to have changed behaviors.

I have pretty much the entire cab stripped bare to expose the wiring harness. Everything looks good, nothing burnt and I have moved around the looms enough to eliminate a chafed or rubbing wire. I don't believe the problem is in the switch or wiring around the switch.

Symptoms now are: starts fine, goes in and out of forward fine, blows fuse as soon as it goes into reverse. There are two reverse relays, one called Reverse (#11) and another called the Reverse Hi/Low Ratio for Powershift machines only (#22) Image

If I remove the Reverse Hi/Low relay, I can hear the first relay (R) click in/out when I move gear shift into reverse. No fuse blows. With both relays in place, blows fuse right away. Tried swapping relays around (22->19) and no change. I think (but not sure as the schematic I am using is not clear) that relay #11 also switches relay #22.

What I can't follow is why switch wire to relay would blow fuse? I thought the purpose of the switch wire was to act as low power circuit control to turn on/off larger circuit. If the reverse Hi/Low solenoids were bad or shorted, I would expect the main fuse before the relay to burn. What am I missing?

Thanks,

Brian


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