Also How much does it cost to get one?Cheers
Young Jack
CPCS
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Joes1989
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Re: CPCS
As far as im aware its now 21! Or thats what i got told! Its about 2000 quid if you havent got any other tickets! You also need a CSCS card that allows you to be on site! If you dont have one most contractors wont let you work!
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Gold Digger
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Re: CPCS
Joes1989 wrote:As far as im aware its now 21! Or thats what i got told! Its about 2000 quid if you havent got any other tickets! You also need a CSCS card that allows you to be on site! If you dont have one most contractors wont let you work!
registration fees ,photos,etc 2 grand and the rest . . ££££££££££££££ 
and ill never afford that lol. Just have to try and get to a company that will train me up.-
IBH
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Re: CPCS
I recall that from the H&S training I've been given, an individual has to be 18 yrs old before they are legally considered to be of an age to be responsible enough to operate any piece of machinery with any degree of competency.
But say if Jacks's dad had a mini digger in a large back garden, with his Dads permission I believe he could dig away to his hearts content because its on Private Property and isn't a commercial business operation.
But say if Jacks's dad had a mini digger in a large back garden, with his Dads permission I believe he could dig away to his hearts content because its on Private Property and isn't a commercial business operation.
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bigkit
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Re: CPCS
The CPCS is one big money making racket. 
I think the CMPE is trying to get an equivelent ticket of the ground. Their existing Certificate of Competance is pretty good and much much cheaper and gets you on most jobs. Most of the big contractors still want CPCS until they need the driver more! Don't get me started, the big firms can just go bury themselves! 
Don't forget..........its not law to have one!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I think the CMPE is trying to get an equivelent ticket of the ground. Their existing Certificate of Competance is pretty good and much much cheaper and gets you on most jobs. Most of the big contractors still want CPCS until they need the driver more! Don't get me started, the big firms can just go bury themselves! Don't forget..........its not law to have one!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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BulldozerD11
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Re: CPCS
With ages for sites a lot is also down to company policies. There are restrictions on what 16 to 18 year olds can do as a job that are a result of several serious accidents and i think are now Legal requirements (but not sure under which H&S regulations as so many different ones) but most big contractors now require special risk assements from any sub contractor employing operatives under 18 years old (this is any operative not plant operators).
When it comes to plant the issue then is the companies insurer may have a 21 rule, as per most motor vehicle policies for hired vans now excluding under 21's.
CSCS and CPCS and other cards are a bit of a joke, as some machines are not on them and the cost of maintaining classes is rocketing (money making scheme ?) - defintely, but this was was originally a good way of main contractors being able to pass the buck for responsibility, as presenting a card says u are competent, and stops the practice of anybody jumping on a machine. (too may idiots treating them as play things). But you still get people with cards who are incompetent. There are a lot of fake cards and other dubious schemes that some contractors accept but others dont. Some firms were issuing there own for things like cherry pickers and sissor lifts.
CSCS cards are also of mixed value as a lot were (are) just given out. The main use is to reduce inductions to a reasonably short time rather tha having to have full day going over the basics (comon sense stuff). They are not compulsory but a way of showing that due diligence has been under taken from a H&S point.
Some sites and firms take inductions very seriously and others its just a case of Fill your name in and contact details on the form and sign it (and tick all the boxes mate). Part of the problem is that when you get 'builder' turning up to site with no boots, had or hi-vis in this day and age were they are compulsory the industry has had to introduce checks to reduce the risk from 'idiots' (this includes some 'professionals' who should know better).
I have had to conducts 1000's of inductions (and dont like some of the stupid questions/ inappropriate items on some of them) but when you see the lack of interest by some in the basics can see why it is needed. The main purpose is to give out the site specific risks and issues to operatives and staff. One surprising thing is the lack of questions that people ask. But a common one is often a lack of information as to what they are actually doing as there firm has not briefed them and issued information such as drawing to them and no supervisor to meet them.
Most jobs end up with a few people excluded from site for H&S issues, which are often perceived as minor but can lead to serious consequences, the the peple involved have not headed requests to stop dangerous practices or follow the agreed method of working and follow site rules.
A common sense test would be more appropriate in some cases, but would then result in a shortage of workers. Also some of the so called 'rules' are inappropriate or stupid at times, along with the risk assessments and associated method statements (which often the sub-contractors sub-contracted labour has not seen / dont have when they turn up).
A lot of H&S professionals have little industry experience of the real world and get wound up about relatively minor points but have not a clue with complex issues. They also want staff to sign off various 'inspections' which they may not have the detailed knowledge to do so. Same as the Log book idea for operatives is flawed idea as some formen will just sign them en block.
Having a ticket unfortuantly does not mean people are competent and seat time is needed to gain proffiency. A lot of these courses are a rip off.
I tried to get the company to get me tickets for Teleporters, Scissor lifts and MEWP's but they would not but my bosses were happy for me to operate these machines when an operator is un available on several sites. But on the same sites we excluded some operatives with tickets as they were deemed incompetent and a risk to others.
There will be a problem in a few years as operators retire, and new ones are priced out of the system, as firms are unwilling to pay for a man to get a ticket as he can walk next week. Some firms 'hold' drivers tickets at head office and present them to site so they 'canot leave' but the operative should carry the card with them on sites for inspection and the card is not the companies property even if they paid for the course (this is disputed by some people), as it actually belongs to the issuing organisation.
A number of the CSCS test questions are ambiguous or wrong and they keep revising them.
Dave
When it comes to plant the issue then is the companies insurer may have a 21 rule, as per most motor vehicle policies for hired vans now excluding under 21's.
CSCS and CPCS and other cards are a bit of a joke, as some machines are not on them and the cost of maintaining classes is rocketing (money making scheme ?) - defintely, but this was was originally a good way of main contractors being able to pass the buck for responsibility, as presenting a card says u are competent, and stops the practice of anybody jumping on a machine. (too may idiots treating them as play things). But you still get people with cards who are incompetent. There are a lot of fake cards and other dubious schemes that some contractors accept but others dont. Some firms were issuing there own for things like cherry pickers and sissor lifts.
CSCS cards are also of mixed value as a lot were (are) just given out. The main use is to reduce inductions to a reasonably short time rather tha having to have full day going over the basics (comon sense stuff). They are not compulsory but a way of showing that due diligence has been under taken from a H&S point.
Some sites and firms take inductions very seriously and others its just a case of Fill your name in and contact details on the form and sign it (and tick all the boxes mate). Part of the problem is that when you get 'builder' turning up to site with no boots, had or hi-vis in this day and age were they are compulsory the industry has had to introduce checks to reduce the risk from 'idiots' (this includes some 'professionals' who should know better).
I have had to conducts 1000's of inductions (and dont like some of the stupid questions/ inappropriate items on some of them) but when you see the lack of interest by some in the basics can see why it is needed. The main purpose is to give out the site specific risks and issues to operatives and staff. One surprising thing is the lack of questions that people ask. But a common one is often a lack of information as to what they are actually doing as there firm has not briefed them and issued information such as drawing to them and no supervisor to meet them.
Most jobs end up with a few people excluded from site for H&S issues, which are often perceived as minor but can lead to serious consequences, the the peple involved have not headed requests to stop dangerous practices or follow the agreed method of working and follow site rules.
A common sense test would be more appropriate in some cases, but would then result in a shortage of workers. Also some of the so called 'rules' are inappropriate or stupid at times, along with the risk assessments and associated method statements (which often the sub-contractors sub-contracted labour has not seen / dont have when they turn up).
A lot of H&S professionals have little industry experience of the real world and get wound up about relatively minor points but have not a clue with complex issues. They also want staff to sign off various 'inspections' which they may not have the detailed knowledge to do so. Same as the Log book idea for operatives is flawed idea as some formen will just sign them en block.
Having a ticket unfortuantly does not mean people are competent and seat time is needed to gain proffiency. A lot of these courses are a rip off.
I tried to get the company to get me tickets for Teleporters, Scissor lifts and MEWP's but they would not but my bosses were happy for me to operate these machines when an operator is un available on several sites. But on the same sites we excluded some operatives with tickets as they were deemed incompetent and a risk to others.
There will be a problem in a few years as operators retire, and new ones are priced out of the system, as firms are unwilling to pay for a man to get a ticket as he can walk next week. Some firms 'hold' drivers tickets at head office and present them to site so they 'canot leave' but the operative should carry the card with them on sites for inspection and the card is not the companies property even if they paid for the course (this is disputed by some people), as it actually belongs to the issuing organisation.
A number of the CSCS test questions are ambiguous or wrong and they keep revising them.
Dave
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Gold Digger
- Posts: 38
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Re: CPCS
B100 LOADER wrote:I am all for safety, but thats just a money making scam.
How can the ordinary man afford that.?
Martyn
If you took out a loan for training to self fund ,what are the chances of being employed as soon as you were classed as being "safe" , How long would you take to pay the loan back after taking out your weekly expenses (shopping ,rent, gas, council tax,motoring expenses just to get to the job etc . etc) and how much would you be earning if you could get a job . . companies that put their workers through the course have the best deal , they can offset their training against tax ,they way i look at it is they dont realy want to promote training for self funders ,sad to say it better trying to get a job serving up big macs , not much training required 
Why bother with the cpcs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLFAJQ7SLewWho is online
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