Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

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le.maisonniau
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Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

Post #1 by le.maisonniau » Sun Oct 01, 2017 8:06 pm

Hi Guys,
I am currently renovating a recent purchase of a Hitach EX27U. 2.7tonner (purchased 3 weeks ago)
Today I removed tracks and all rollers (1 top 4 bottom each side) one of the 8 bottom one was trashed.
I removed the idler wheels to check them as prior to this work I had a loud squeal from one of the tracks but couldn't quite decide which one :dizzy:
The idler wheels both seem in excellent order, with extremely little play, however at the end of each wheel support/guide there is a very large plate which the adjuster/tensioner ram butts up against, on the LHS the plate is noticeable bent (see pic) I am just wondering as to A: remove plate and turn it the oppostite way? B: leave it alone as it may be OK when reinstalled correctly ? C: get a replacement plate made up?

This also leads me to ask if anyone could suggest a possible cause :idea: obviously a plate of this thickness would have needed a LOT of force to bend it like that, perhaps previous user was smacking the tracks into immovable objects etc. Another thought would be the result of incorrect tension casuing to and fro movements?

I have included a couple of pics showing the degree of bend in the plates; maybe I am being a bit overcautious :think:
What is NOT shown is an indentation on the face of both plates from the tensioner ram end !!! about 2-3mm deep.

Now, have I done the right thing, I have taken all 7 bottom rollers and steeped them in a bucket of diesel as none of them moved, after a couple of hours they now rotate, I intend tomorrow to steep them for a few days in a bucket of mineral oil!!! is this a good thing? was it OK to soak them in diesel? :arrrrgh:

I am new to tracked excavators, so any hints, tips or guides welcome.
Idler bent!.JPG
Idler #1.jpg
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Re: Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

Post #2 by Jeremy Rowland » Sun Oct 01, 2017 8:26 pm

Hi John,

Well first the bent plate; to be fair I don't suppose for one minute that it would make any difference if you left it alone, however it looks like it is simply a piece of steel with two holes drilled through it so it would not cost a lot to get one made up if you were that concerned with it, you could also put it in a press and straiten it again then simply fit it the other way around.
The track rollers I guess would be sealed for life so after a while the ingress of damp and moisture can lead to seizure I would look at the cost of after market replacements, somebody like Itstrac at Willenhall and assess the cost. Hope that helps.

Jeremy


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Re: Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

Post #3 by diggerjones » Sun Oct 01, 2017 11:23 pm

I've just done the undercarriage on my 1.5 mini. My rollers were all knackered, 6 in total. My rollers were 52 plus vat each. Your doing the right thing soaking them. Just keep your eyes on them to make sure they keep rolling. Mine were square.


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Re: Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

Post #4 by le.maisonniau » Mon Oct 02, 2017 2:02 pm

Thanks Guys, makes me feel happier.
my rollers are approx 65 plus vat each - but 10 all together (tots up!)
Good thing about the rollers is they can be changed at a later date without taking the tracks back off.
I will see about getting a couple of plates knocked up, there is a decent metal workshop just down the road from me.
There are 4 holes in each plate, but I have a drill press too, so could just get some plate.

Cheers :thumbup:
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Re: Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

Post #5 by le.maisonniau » Tue Oct 31, 2017 10:20 pm

Hi Guys,
Update, I looked again at the idler rollers and decided to take out the old bolts, turn the plates around and refit them.
I drilled the holes out at M12, used M10 high tensile bolts with a 2mm copper bush (see pix) this seems to have worked out OK.
Seeing the job they do, it is now a lot better than previous.
For the bushing I used French copper pipe as it is 1mm thick walls, and using 10mm pipe gives a nice snug fit for a M10 bolt in a 12mm hole.


Pix of progress with Idlers attached.
Have ordered two bottom and two top rollers, all the others were soaked in diesel for 2 days, soaked in oil for 8 days and are now resting in a tub, ready to be replaced in a couple of weeks time when I get back from UK with new stuff.

Hydraulic oil and pipes are next. See new thread. :insomnia:


Image

Image
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Re: Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

Post #6 by Jeremy Rowland » Wed Nov 01, 2017 8:49 am

John that looks like you have made a good job of it :thumbup:

Jeremy


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Re: Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

Post #7 by le.maisonniau » Sun Dec 31, 2017 1:16 pm

Ready for re-fitting,

Hi guys, sorry if this question is obvious to most (not me!) I have serviced the tensioner rams etc, and both Idler wheels, I am now ready to start refitting the m/c.
I have offered up the idler wheel into its housing - but it is extremely tight and will not go in more than 1/4th way :o I am guessing as I have rebolted it with M10's in M12 holes bushed for the M10 bolts (replacing the old M8's :dizzy: ) I may have widened the frame slightly as there was/is a tiny bit of play on the Idler wheel's axles.
I don't want to bosh it in place with a hammer :doh: as I believe it should slide in and out quite easily :thumbup:
This being the case, should I just file of a little off the cheeks so it goes in easy? :| (after greasing the runway)

And, best wishes to all for 2018 :wave:
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Re: Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

Post #8 by mechman » Sun Dec 31, 2017 3:09 pm

Hi John
That roller assembly has got to go back no matter what, so if it were me I would look at the roller assembly first to see if it's twisted and just file it to suit, I don't think that you could hurt it. :)
Norm.


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Re: Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

Post #9 by Jeremy Rowland » Sun Dec 31, 2017 5:23 pm

Hi John what I would do is firstly slacken off the bolts from your repair and see if the idler wheel fits easily then; it may be that the new bolts are holding the assembly in a slightly wider than normal position? Once you've proved the point you opt to slightly elongate the bolt holes, make a new plate to pattern or clamp in a vice before tightening the bolts. Just a suggestion. :thumbup:

Jeremy


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Re: Idler roller - how much tolerance / damage is allowed?

Post #10 by le.maisonniau » Mon Jan 01, 2018 2:15 pm

:( Hi guys (Mechman & Jeremy)
Thanks for the input, I have cleaned the track this morning and filed the end pieces where I can see them fouling, just taking off a thou' at a time, it is getting there, plus lots of grease, I now have it so it goes about halfway inside the track before it sticks -- they are just so flipping heavy it is hard going :o

I think I will also slacken the bolts and clamp them up before tightening again as well, good pointer Jeremy :thumbup:

Still what else should I be doing on New years day lol :D Very windy and chucking it down with rain here in France. :arrrrgh:
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